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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 23, 2006 18:18:48 GMT
I dont have time to go to demos. To busy looking after kids, working etc. I cant afford to travel all around the uk either. I think we all try to do our best and no one has the right to point out who isnt doing enough. Excuses? The coaches offer a cut rate price and I see many parents on demos.
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 23, 2006 18:22:41 GMT
It seems to me that you have joined this forum to just cause trouble. Not all of us have the priviledge of having co-workers that will give up their weekend and FYI I have used up all my spare extra holiday dates this year going to demos. *Sighs* Always has to be one that can't grow up. No If I wanted to cause trouble I would trash the board. I replied to a post and because you do not like my reply you lable me a trouble maker. Your patronising tone is the only trouble I see.
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 23, 2006 18:44:33 GMT
Excuses? The coaches offer a cut rate price and I see many parents on demos. Excuses??? in what way? I do my bit for animals, you do not know me so stop judging other. Geeezzz, have you anything nice to say at all. Are you the best animal rights fighter around? am i missing something? Maybe you should not waste your time on here, i am sure you could be at some sort of demo or libertaing something as we speak. Now there is no need to get all ratty. Tell me what has attending national demos got to do with liberating animals? You said you couldn't afford and I pointed out it was affordable, certainly cheaper than a month internet subscription
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 23, 2006 19:12:32 GMT
Now there is no need to get all ratty. Tell me what has attending national demos got to do with liberating animals? You said you couldn't afford and I pointed out it was affordable, certainly cheaper than a month internet subscription Well i was just pointing out that you could in your spare time True, but i am at work I shall cancel my mobile contract to. How do you know I don't? So you have no internet at home then? You have a mobile on contract?!? Not quiet as skint as you would have us all believe
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Post by applecrumble on Oct 23, 2006 19:31:58 GMT
thanks to those who get to demos, I usually can't. But I won't be getting defensive about it.
neverending activism can lead to burnout.
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 23, 2006 19:49:12 GMT
thanks to those who get to demos, I usually can't. But I won't be getting defensive about it. neverending activism can lead to burnout. No danger of that around here by the sounds of it ;D
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Post by bobbywomble on Oct 23, 2006 21:20:13 GMT
well then find another forum to post on if you dont like it
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Post by tabitha on Oct 23, 2006 21:37:33 GMT
thanks to those who get to demos, I usually can't. But I won't be getting defensive about it. neverending activism can lead to burnout. No danger of that around here by the sounds of it ;D Oh great!! another one!!!
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Post by Tiggerwoos on Oct 23, 2006 22:20:20 GMT
It seems to me that you have joined this forum to just cause trouble. Not all of us have the priviledge of having co-workers that will give up their weekend and FYI I have used up all my spare extra holiday dates this year going to demos. *Sighs* Always has to be one that can't grow up. No If I wanted to cause trouble I would trash the board. I replied to a post and because you do not like my reply you lable me a trouble maker. Your patronising tone is the only trouble I see. Where would trashing the board get you? This board itself has contibuted to many new vegans going vegan and old ones staying vegan as a lot of vegans do find it lonely. I find your manner which you have come here, telling people what you consider is wrong, due to other people's commitments very sad. It isn't fellow vegans that need to have you criticising them like this, it's the government. This sort of behaviour coming from you would probably intimidate a new person from going to demos as it is standoffish and insulting. Please speak to people with respect on this forum or you will be removed. Also talk of trashing the board is not tolerated.
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 24, 2006 11:33:55 GMT
No If I wanted to cause trouble I would trash the board. I replied to a post and because you do not like my reply you lable me a trouble maker. Your patronising tone is the only trouble I see. Where would trashing the board get you? This board itself has contibuted to many new vegans going vegan and old ones staying vegan as a lot of vegans do find it lonely. I find your manner which you have come here, telling people what you consider is wrong, due to other people's commitments very sad. It isn't fellow vegans that need to have you criticising them like this, it's the government. This sort of behaviour coming from you would probably intimidate a new person from going to demos as it is standoffish and insulting. Please speak to people with respect on this forum or you will be removed. Also talk of trashing the board is not tolerated. I suggest you read what I posted in reply to you before you get your knickers in a twist. You accused me of coming here to cause trouble and I said " if I wanted to cause trouble I would have trashed the forum" now that is not saying I am going to trash the forum. Please keep up. From spending some time reading through much of this forum before posting I got the impression from many who post that they have a large chip on their shoulder and that alone turns people away. The forum stats reflect this............... Now you think me 'criticising' the committment of other is intimidating? Well you should take a step back the next time you manage to get to an AR demo and listeren to the 'chants' coming from people! Look at the way activist react when giving out leaflets if someone disagrees with them! Go to a street stall and ask questions, see how intimidating one can feel! Please point out the post that you found intimidating. Now since the numbers of AR activists attending demos has drastcally gone down in recent years - from many thousands to barely 800/1000 - I think I have a right to question it on an AR forum, don't you? 2/3 years ago SHAC mobile demos attracted 200/300 yet the last SHAC mobile demo only 2 cars full turned up!! Within the space of 12 months the decline was alarming! I wonder if Martin L King made up excuses so he didn't have to attend a rally? Yes I do question peoples committment. Now what I find sad is the way this site treats new commers who have the front to question. Time to wake up and smell the coffee, the AR movement is on it's arse and if everyone got off their arse instead of spending time talking about doing something we would be in a stronger possition! Now if you want to ban me then so be it. You can then drop back into your comfy little family can't you?
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Post by applecrumble on Oct 24, 2006 11:53:34 GMT
Hi everyone this is a very friendly forum where we are gradually getting to know one another, but like any forum it can ban people that overstep the mark. Asking people to go on demos is one thing, criticising them for not doing it is another. I know if you work hard as an activist to stop suffering it can be very disappointing and frustrating when people do not seem to support you, but if you make a big issue out of it you can end up losing friends. IMO respecting peoples choices really helps you get on with them and makes it more likely that you can have some dialogue and try to persuade them of your point of view, if they're interersted.
If you find you're getting really angry with people for not supporting you maybe you need to think a bit about your own wellbeing?
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 24, 2006 12:06:16 GMT
Hi everyone this is a very friendly forum where we are gradually getting to know one another, but like any forum it can ban people that overstep the mark. Asking people to go on demos is one thing, criticising them for not doing it is another. I know if you work hard as an activist to stop suffering it can be very disappointing and frustrating when people do not seem to support you, but if you make a big issue out of it you can end up losing friends. IMO respecting peoples choices really helps you get on with them and makes it more likely that you can have some dialogue and try to persuade them of your point of view, if they're interersted. If you find you're getting really angry with people for not supporting you maybe you need to think a bit about your own wellbeing? ;D This is funny. Movements need to question it's supporters and it needs critics within the movements, thats the way we move forward. Making cheap insults about a persons well being because they question the decline of the movement due to lack of committment is an eye opener All this talk of burning out and frustration comes from weak minded people. Overstep the mark? What for? For telling the truth?
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Post by veggiesosage on Oct 24, 2006 13:01:39 GMT
You are of course entitled to express your opinion that there is a problem with a lack of attendance at demos. however please do this from a point of view of respect for those who might either disagree with you or who would like to go but don't for their own reasons.
Its not universally accepted that demos change things, some argue that they create bad publicity and make things worse. that's not my opinion, but that opinion is out there. Theres room on here for healthy debate here on that issue.
However, there are a number of members here who are vegans but are not 'activists' and that is also up to them. Its not appropriate to slag people off for making that decision as they have every right to make it. Its quite possible to disagree with someone but still treat them with respect and that's what we expect everyone here to do.
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 24, 2006 13:56:59 GMT
You are of course entitled to express your opinion that there is a problem with a lack of attendance at demos. however please do this from a point of view of respect for those who might either disagree with you or who would like to go but don't for their own reasons. Its not universally accepted that demos change things, some argue that they create bad publicity and make things worse. that's not my opinion, but that opinion is out there. Theres room on here for healthy debate here on that issue. However, there are a number of members here who are vegans but are not 'activists' and that is also up to them. Its not appropriate to slag people off for making that decision as they have every right to make it. Its quite possible to disagree with someone but still treat them with respect and that's what we expect everyone here to do. What isn't appropriate is for moderators to 'scold' other is public. If you have a problem and want to address it then please send me a PM. If you want me to leave I will do so. I have read the board rules and have not broken any. I find that respect is earned and doesn't come automatially when you proclaim to be a vegan. This section of the forum is on the SPEAK demo so I expect them taking part are activists if not please announce where you stand and I will make my apologies.
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Post by Pob on Oct 24, 2006 15:01:22 GMT
I find that respect is earned and doesn't come automatially when you proclaim to be a vegan. I think that works both ways, though. It doesn't come automatically just because you (about whom we know nothing) claim to be more dedicated to going to SPEAK demos than anyone else on this board. Those of us that work can't get to every protest that we would like to, and even people that don't work can't manage to be in the dozens of places they would need to be on any given day to support every cause that they would want to. I honestly don't think it is going to be the demos that will get that building stopped, re-purposed, or demolished. I do believe that they are important, though, to show that we are still intent on stopping that place from becoming operational.
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Post by tabitha on Oct 24, 2006 16:08:35 GMT
I dont have time to go to demos. To busy looking after kids, working etc. I cant afford to travel all around the uk either. I think we all try to do our best and no one has the right to point out who isnt doing enough. Excuses? The coaches offer a cut rate price and I see many parents on demos. I cant get to many demos either. I work extremely long hours every other weekend. I would have loved to have gone last weekend. My partner went with a friend though. We all do our best. Its not up to anyone else to judge. I have a customer with cerebral palsy who is desperate to come on a demo and I am trying to figure out a way of getting her there. Hopefully we can sort something out.
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Post by saucyvegan on Oct 24, 2006 17:12:12 GMT
Excuses? The coaches offer a cut rate price and I see many parents on demos. I cant get to many demos either. I work extremely long hours every other weekend. I would have loved to have gone last weekend. My partner went with a friend though. We all do our best. Its not up to anyone else to judge. I have a customer with cerebral palsy who is desperate to come on a demo and I am trying to figure out a way of getting her there. Hopefully we can sort something out. Tabs, let me know if ur friend can get to the next SPEAK demo and if she doesn't mind, would she mind being right at the front? Im gonna do what the other side do and play on the human emotion.
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 24, 2006 17:56:15 GMT
I find that respect is earned and doesn't come automatially when you proclaim to be a vegan. I think that works both ways, though. It doesn't come automatically just because you (about whom we know nothing) claim to be more dedicated to going to SPEAK demos than anyone else on this board. Those of us that work can't get to every protest that we would like to, and even people that don't work can't manage to be in the dozens of places they would need to be on any given day to support every cause that they would want to. I honestly don't think it is going to be the demos that will get that building stopped, re-purposed, or demolished. I do believe that they are important, though, to show that we are still intent on stopping that place from becoming operational. I haven't made any claims that I attend more SPEAK demos than other or that I am more dedicate than others. I have said that 'you are not alone' in a post meaning WE ARE ALL GUILTY! With all due respect to your opinion I would rather not speculated on what is going to work or not because Rob and Mel have much experience in running this sort of campaign and I know that it is sometime frustrating for people when they are trying to rally people in support yet they stay at home or go to work because they have their own opinion, see what I mean? I can see that my posts have people thinking and just by reading the 2 posts above you can see people are working things out and are finding that you do not need money or a car because people will try to get you there That's what is so special about people in the movement ;D SPEAK organise these demos for a very good reason. My posts may be though provoking but not intimidating, nasty or insulting and lets face it they have people talking and it looks like one person at least is going to get to demos in the future
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Post by tabitha on Oct 24, 2006 18:01:30 GMT
Thought provoking??? Is that how you see yourself.........?
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Post by vegan6pack on Oct 24, 2006 18:09:13 GMT
Excuses? The coaches offer a cut rate price and I see many parents on demos. I cant get to many demos either. I work extremely long hours every other weekend. I would have loved to have gone last weekend. My partner went with a friend though. We all do our best. Its not up to anyone else to judge. I have a customer with cerebral palsy who is desperate to come on a demo and I am trying to figure out a way of getting her there. Hopefully we can sort something out. I am sure you will sort things out for you and your friend. What has stuck out for me about the movement is that people bend over backwards to help each other but without discussion we would still not know of your current problem. Now it is out in the open I am sure help will be at hand To say everyone makes up excuses would be naive of me but I am sure we all know that alot of people do make up excuses and make out they do more than what they do. This is the time for us ALL to go out and support SPEAK and if you have problems with travel ask around. I am aware of coaches with places left that could be filled up for nothing if activists can't afford. This is what the movement is all about.
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